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w3526602 John Williams
Burton Latimer, Kettering, Northamptonshire, UK   GBR
I thought I would run it by the MOT station even though it was not technically due.

Hi Andew,

It was always the case that a premature MOT did not void a current MOT, but there was still the matter of a car having to be road-worthy. Nobody could stop you driving a dangerous car away after a test.

Changes to MOT procedures will have three grades of fail ... Dangerous - you cannot drive away. Serious - you can take it away to get it fixed. And Not Serious ... sort of equivalent to "advisory" I think these changes come in on 20th May. After that, a fail will void a current MOT certificate. There will be little advantage in presenting your car for an early MOT ... if it fails, it will be off the road.

602

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0123 Mike D
Biddulph, Staffs, UK   GBR
Here's the VIN on me bike
Probably a bit unusual in the UK


Attachments:
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ferd 7.JPG

0123 Mike D
Biddulph, Staffs, UK   GBR
In reply to # 29421 by w3526602 I thought I would run it by the MOT station even though it was not technically due.

Hi Andew,

It was always the case that a premature MOT did not void a current MOT That's not the way I understand it,
but there was still the matter of a car having to be road-worthy. Nobody could stop you driving a dangerous car away after a test. Try telling that to the rozzers

Changes to MOT procedures will have three grades of fail ... Dangerous - you cannot drive away. Serious - you can take it away to get it fixed. And Not Serious ... sort of equivalent to "advisory" I think these changes come in on 20th May. After that, a fail will void a current MOT certificate. There will be little advantage in presenting your car for an early MOT ... if it fails, it will be off the road. You seem to be contradicting yourself

602

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w3526602 John Williams
Burton Latimer, Kettering, Northamptonshire, UK   GBR
You punting for the last of the "Ockard Boys" then 02

Hi Mike,

Sorry, I don't understand the reference. ???

602

0123 Mike D
Biddulph, Staffs, UK   GBR
I forgive you smiling smiley

w3526602 John Williams
Burton Latimer, Kettering, Northamptonshire, UK   GBR
Hi Mike,

<<< It was always the case that a premature MOT did not void a current MOT That's not the way I understand it, >>>

My understanding is that a car must have passed an MOT within the previous 12 months. If it fails another test after 11 months, the original certificate was still issued within the previous 12 months. This was before MOT were computerised ... so if you produced the original certificate, how would they know that it had since failed? OK, it could be done, but would Plod deem it worth his time and effort, in normal circumstances?

Just because a car does not have a valid MOT certificate, or you cannot find it, does not mean the car is unroadworthy. Not producing an MOT certificate is not an endorsable offence. I do not know if it will become endorsable after 20th May.

<<< Nobody could stop you driving a dangerous car away after a test. Try telling that to the rozzers >>>

An MOT tester had no authority to prevent you leaving his premises. Who else might have authority to prevent you? What are the chances of being stopped by Plod ... unless the tester has reported you? The Government have tacitly given you permission to drive an unroadworthy car to and from an MOT test. Being unroadworthy, for MOT purposes, could be a small rust hole in a sill, or a rear seat belt not working, or a rear door that cannot be opened from inside. None of which make the car any more dangerouse than it was yesterday. As it stands today, if your car has no brakes, or an inner tube bulging through the tyre, you can drive away from the test garage ...and that is when Plod can stop you, and sieze your car. Your car is dangerous, rather than being just an MOT failure.

From 20th May, it will be an offence to drive away from a test, IF the tester deems the car to be dangerous. I don't know if he can physically prevent you from doing so, but I bet he can report you, and will be required to give evidence when you appear in court. That's even if you manage to get home without incident.

<<< There will be little advantage in presenting your car for an early MOT ... if it fails, it will be off the road. You seem to be contradicting yourself >>>

At present, you can take an MOT a month before the old certificate expires. Although this is called a 13 month MOT, it will still expire 12 months after the date of when the old certificate was due to expire. You do not get an extra month's MOT. The advantage to you is that you are aware of any work required to pass an MOT, and have it done at your convenience.

From 20th May, an MOT fail will cancel whatever time is left on your old certificate. The computer will tell Plod. So if you regularly go for early MOTs, you risk having to take an MOT every 11 months. Where is the advantage in that? The disadvantage is that eventually, every car will be booked in for an MOT on the aniversary of its first registration. The MOT testers are going to love having their Summer holidays disrupted by a sudden surge of business. (DVLC introduced twice yearly registration number changes to smooth out the peak and trough of all new registrations happening on the same day ... to the advantage of DVLC. Everybody wanted to be the first with the new letter on their number plate ... something that is less meaningful with the current format).

602

w3526602 John Williams
Burton Latimer, Kettering, Northamptonshire, UK   GBR
Hi.

Here;s what HMG have to say about the new MOT rules. You really ought to read it.

https://www.gov.uk/government/news/mot-changes-20-may-2018

602

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0123 Mike D
Biddulph, Staffs, UK   GBR
The revised definition reads:
To be considered as a VHI the vehicle must have been first registered over 40 years ago and the following
components need to be of a design of which would have been fitted to that vehicle at the time of its
manufacture.
• the original unmodified chassis or body shell (including any sub frames) or,
• a new chassis or monocoque bodyshell (including any subframes) of the same specification as the
original
• suspension (front and back)
• steering assembly
• all axles
• transmission
• engine

https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukia/2017/138/pdfs/ukia_20170138_en.pdf

w3526602 John Williams
Burton Latimer, Kettering, Northamptonshire, UK   GBR
Hi Mike,

The rules are not yet written in stone.

Do a Google for Vehicles of Historical Interest (VHI): Substantial Change Guidance, the top three results should cover most things. The links are too long to paste here.

602

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0123 Mike D
Biddulph, Staffs, UK   GBR
I gave the information
And the reference 02

How folks use it is up to them

w3526602 John Williams
Burton Latimer, Kettering, Northamptonshire, UK   GBR
Hi,

Herewith the latest guidlines about MOT exemption for Vehicles of Historic Interest (VTI). It is hoped these will be the final draft.

Sorry, Something went wrong between Copy and Paste, but no doubt you can insert some spaces between the numbered paragraphs.

602

<<< Vehicles of Historical Interest (VHI): Substantial Change Guidance
Most vehicles manufactured or first registered over 40 years ago will, as of 20 May
2018, be exempt from periodic testing unless they have been substantially changed1.
Large goods vehicles (i.e. goods vehicles with a maximum laden weight of more than
3.5 tonnes) and buses (i.e. vehicles with 8 or more seats) that are used commercially
will not be exempted from periodic testing at 40 years.
A vehicle that has been substantially changed within the previous 30 years will have
to be submitted for annual MoT testing. Whether a substantially changed vehicle
requires re-registration is a separate process.
Keepers of VHIs exempt from periodic testing continue to be responsible for their
vehicle’s roadworthiness. Keepers of vehicles over 40 years old can voluntarily
submit vehicles for testing.
Keepers of VHIs claiming an exemption from the MoT test should make a declaration
when renewing their vehicle tax. The responsibility to ensure the declared vehicle is
a VHI and meets the criteria, rests with the vehicle keeper as part of their due
diligence. If a vehicle keeper is not sure of the status of a vehicle, they can consult
a marque or historic vehicles expert, a list of whom will be available on the website of
the Federation of British Historic Vehicle Clubs.
If a vehicle keeper cannot determine that the vehicle has not been substantially
changed, they should not claim an exemption from the MoT test.
The criteria for substantial change
A vehicle will be considered substantially changed if the technical characteristics of
the main components have changed in the previous 30 years, unless the changes
fall into specific categories. These main components for vehicles, other than
motorcycles2, are:
Chassis (replacements of the same pattern as the original are not considered a
substantial change) or Monocoque bodyshell including any sub-frames
(replacements of the same pattern as the original are not considered a substantial
change);
Axles and running gear – alteration of the type and or method of suspension or
steering constitutes a substantial change;
Engine – alternative cubic capacities of the same basic engine and alternative
original equipment engines are not considered a substantial change. If the number
1 If the type of vehicle is still in production, it is not exempt from periodic testing.
2 Further arrangements for motorcycles may be introduced, including if core testing standards are considered
further internationally.
of cylinders in an engine is different from the original, it is likely to be, but not
necessarily, the case that the current engine is not alternative original equipment.
The following are considered acceptable (not substantial) changes if they fall into
these specific categories:
• changes that are made to preserve a vehicle, which in all cases must be when
original type parts are no longer reasonably available;
• changes of a type, that can be demonstrated to have been made when
vehicles of the type were in production or in general use (within ten years of
the end of production);
• in respect of axles and running gear changes made to improve efficiency,
safety or environmental performance;
• in respect of vehicles that have been commercial vehicles, changes which can
be demonstrated were being made when they were used commercially.
In addition if a vehicle (including a motorcycle):
• has been issued with a registration number with a ‘Q’ prefix; or
• is a kit car assembled from components from different makes and model of
vehicle; or
• is a reconstructed classic vehicle as defined by DVLA guidance; or
• is a kit conversion, where a kit of new parts is added to an existing vehicle, or
old parts are added to a kit of a manufactured body, chassis or monocoque
bodyshell changing the general appearance of the vehicle;
it will be considered to have been substantially changed and will not be exempt
from MOT testing.
However if any of the four above types of vehicle is taxed as an “historic vehicle” and
has not been modified during the previous 30 years, it can be considered as a VHI.
This guidance is only intended to determine the testing position of a
substantially changed vehicle, not its registration.
How to declare a vehicle for the 40 year MOT exemption
Vehicle keepers are required to ensure that their vehicles are taxed when used on a
public road. From 20 May 2018, at the point of taxing a vehicle, the vehicle keeper
can declare their vehicle exempt from MOT if it was constructed more than 40 years
ago.
When declaring an exemption, you will be required to confirm that it has not been
substantially changed (as defined in this guidance). This process will be applied to
pre-1960 registered vehicles, as well as newer vehicles in the historic vehicle tax
class.
If the vehicle does not have an MOT and you wish to continue using it on the public
roads, you will have either to undergo an MOT or, if you wish exemption from the
MOT, to declare that the vehicle is a VHI.
If the vehicle has a current MOT certificate but you anticipate that on expiry of that
certificate you will wish exemption from future MOTs you will at the time of
relicensing be required to declare that the vehicle is a VHI.
How to tax your vehicle in the historic vehicle tax class
Where vehicle keepers first apply for the historic vehicle tax class, it must be done at
a Post Office. If you are declaring that your vehicle is exempt from MOT, you will
need to complete a V112 declaration form, taking into consideration the substantially
changed guidelines, (as defined above). Further re-licensing applications, including
making subsequent declarations that the vehicle does not require an MOT, can be
completed online.
Further advice on taxing in the historic vehicle tax class can be found via the
following link:
https://www.gov.uk/historic-vehicles
Advice (not part of the Guidance)
What do I need to do if I am responsible for a vehicle aged more than 40 years
old and first registered in or after 1960?
From 20 May 2018 most of these vehicles will not need a valid MOT certificate to be
used on public roads. You still need to keep the vehicle in a roadworthy condition
and can voluntarily have a test. We recommend continued regular maintenance and
checks of the vehicle.
You need to check whether the vehicle has been substantially altered in the last 30
years, checking against the criteria (in the guidance above). If it has been altered
substantially a valid MOT certificate will continue to be required. If you are unsure
check, for example from an expert on historic vehicles (list referenced in the
guidance). If you buy a vehicle, we also recommend checking with the previous
owner if you can.
The registration number of a vehicle should not be used to determine if the vehicle is
a VHI as it may not reflect the vehicle’s age (cherished transfers, reconstructed
classic vehicles etc.) The registration certificate (V5C) is more authoritative, but
there are specific cases for example related to imported vehicles where in some
cases the age of the vehicle would not have been captured at point of registration.
If your vehicle does not have a current MOT certificate and is exempt from needing
an MOT test you will need to declare this each time when you apply for Vehicle
Excise Duty.
For large vehicles, see also the later sections.
What do I need to do if I am responsible for a vehicle first registered before
1960?
These vehicles are currently exempt from the requirement for a valid MOT certificate
to be used on public roads. Most, but not all, will continue to be exempt. You still
need to keep the vehicle in a roadworthy condition and can voluntarily have a test.
We recommend continued regular maintenance and checks of the vehicle.
You need to check whether the vehicle has been substantially altered within the last
30 years checking against the criteria (in the guidance notes). If it has been
substantially changed, an MOT certificate will be required for its use on public roads
from 20th May 2018, even if the vehicle has previously not required an MOT.
If your vehicle does not have a current MOT test certificate and is exempt from
needing an MOT test you will need to declare this each time when you apply for
Vehicle Excise Duty.
If you are responsible for a large goods vehicle (more than 3.5 tonnes) or a public
service vehicle (with 8 or more passenger seats) used commercially, you will require
a valid test certificate if the vehicle has been substantially changed in the last 30
years or if, in the case of a goods vehicle, it is used when laden or towing a laden
trailer.
Which old, large vehicles do not require testing from 20th May 2018?
Buses and other public service vehicles with 8 or more seats that are used
commercially are exempt if they are pre-1960 vehicles. This is still the case from 20th
May 2018 unless they have been substantially changed.
Buses that are not public service vehicles over 40 years old are exempt from 20th
May 2018 if they meet the new definition of “vehicle of historical interest”.
Large goods vehicles (of more than 3.5 tonnes) are exempt from testing, if first used
before 1960 and used unladen, but provided (with effect from 20th May 2018) they
have not have been substantially changed.
A small number of pre-1960 large goods vehicles will require goods vehicle tests. If
they have never been tested, owners will need to apply for a first test using a VTG1
application form. This includes contact details for DVSA, which can be used in the
event of practical problems, for example concerns about testability and finding a test
centre.
Some separate exemptions from testing in full or parts of the test are relevant to
some old, large goods vehicles. For example steam powered vehicles are exempt
from testing. Another example is in respect of the petrol driven historic lorries, all
spark ignition (petrol) vehicles over 3.5tonnes are exempt from a metered check in
the test.

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