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Rebuilding suspension

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drooartz Avatar
drooartz Drew Frink
Midway, UT, USA   USA
It's time to completely rebuild Maggie's suspension. It's all pretty worn, based on driving feel. Plan to replace everything that normally wears out. I have a week off in April when I'll have time, but likely won't have time beforehand to really inspect everything, so I'm planning on ordering the works and doing it all no matter what. Going urethane.

I had a chat with Gerard a year or so ago and he gave me a rundown on the normal wear bits. I *think* I've captured all the bits based on my notes, but would love another set of eyes on my list as I'm not as familiar with the Minor stuff. I used ESM for my list as their website is good, but I'm not tied to using them as a vendor. Just want to make sure my list is complete.

FRONT

Tie bar kit @2
http://www.morrisminorspares.com/front-suspension-c47/front-suspension-all-models-c71/tie-bar-kit-with-polyurethane-bushes-one-side-per-kit-p830499

Upper Trunion
http://www.morrisminorspares.com/front-suspension-c47/front-suspension-all-models-c71/trunnion-kit-top-l-h-made-in-uk-without-upper-pivot-pin-polyurethane-bushes-p830498
http://www.morrisminorspares.com/front-suspension-c47/front-suspension-all-models-c71/trunnion-kit-top-r-h-made-in-uk-without-upper-pivot-pin-polyurethane-bushes-p830497

Upper pivot pin @2
http://www.morrisminorspares.com/front-suspension-c47/front-suspension-all-models-c71/upper-pivot-kit-damper-to-top-trunnion-no-bushes-p830516

Lower Trunion
http://www.morrisminorspares.com/front-suspension-c47/front-suspension-all-models-c71/trunnion-kit-lower-l-h-made-in-uk-p830547
http://www.morrisminorspares.com/front-suspension-c47/front-suspension-all-models-c71/trunnion-kit-lower-r-h-made-in-uk-p830546

Bumpstop under shock arm @2
http://www.morrisminorspares.com/front-suspension-c47/front-suspension-all-models-c71/lower-rebound-check-bracket-fits-under-front-shocker-arm-made-by-esm-to-original-specification-p830528

Bumpstop upper
http://www.morrisminorspares.com/front-suspension-c47/front-suspension-all-models-c71/upper-front-bump-stop-l-h-p830530
http://www.morrisminorspares.com/front-suspension-c47/front-suspension-all-models-c71/upper-front-bump-stop-r-h-p830529

(these come with trunnion kit already?)
Kingpin boots @4
http://www.morrisminorspares.com/front-suspension-c47/front-suspension-all-models-c71/seal-trunnion-swivel-pin-mmc-branded-top-or-bottom-p830550

Lower outer trunnion sealing ring @4
http://www.morrisminorspares.com/front-suspension-c47/front-suspension-all-models-c71/sealing-ring-bottom-trunnion-mmc-branded-2-required-per-trunnion-each-p830551

Torsion bar bushings?

REAR

Rebuilt shocks (PeterC World Wide)
http://www.nosimport.com/british-cars-nos-parts/British-bmc-austin-mg-morris/morris-parts?product_id=1283

Complete Rear Leaf Spring Kit - 5 Leaf Springs
http://www.morrisminorspares.com/rear-suspension-axle-propshaft-c87/rear-suspension-c89/complete-rear-leaf-spring-kit-5-leaf-springs-saloon-convertible-polyurethane-bushes-p831328

Shock link
http://www.morrisminorspares.com/rear-suspension-axle-propshaft-c87/rear-suspension-c89/rear-shock-absorber-damper-link-unit-to-chassis-p831366

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0123 Mike D
Biddulph, Staffs, UK   GBR
I'd say the spring are too cheap to be any good
I rebushed our old'uns with rubber bushes
which restored most of the ride height

How long are your old'uns with the load off

emjay Jim English
Marietta, PA, USA   USA
I didn't see the eyebolts on your list. If the bushings are still rubber and have been in there for a long time, it's likely the bushing is worn through and now is metal on metal and that means a worn eyebolt. Of course, the pin and bushings are most definitely needed as well as silicone grease for the bushings. Poly don't twist. They really are bearings.

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drooartz Avatar
drooartz Drew Frink
Midway, UT, USA   USA
Admittedly I'm not that worried about the springs, it was more that kit seemed to have all the necessary bits. Not sure what you mean by "How long are your old'uns with the load off" -- I assume this is measuring my rear leafs, but I'm not clear on "how long."

In reply to # 29069 by 0123
I'd say the spring are too cheap to be any good
I rebushed our old'uns with rubber bushes
which restored most of the ride height

How long are your old'uns with the load off

brianmminimania Brian M
Nevada City, CA, USA   USA
drooartz Avatar
drooartz Drew Frink
Midway, UT, USA   USA
Not sure what you mean by eyebolts. I did see a reference to them when I was looking up parts, but not sure where that fits in the suspension.

I really need to spend some time with an exploded diagram of the suspension.

In reply to # 29072 by emjay I didn't see the eyebolts on your list. If the bushings are still rubber and have been in there for a long time, it's likely the bushing is worn through and now is metal on metal and that means a worn eyebolt. Of course, the pin and bushings are most definitely needed as well as silicone grease for the bushings. Poly don't twist. They really are bearings.

0123 Mike D
Biddulph, Staffs, UK   GBR
How many inches / cms long are
your old springs when neither the
weight of the car nor the weight
of the axle is on them

Not that it's important if
you only buy the fitting kit

smiling smiley

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emjay Jim English
Marietta, PA, USA   USA
Here are the ESM links. These bushings are the ones that wear the most and poly is a great improvement. It's a very heavily loaded point. The second is the lower link/trunnion.

http://www.morrisminorspares.com/front-suspension-c47/front-suspension-all-models-c71/eyebolt-connects-lower-suspension-arm-to-chassis-manufactured-by-esm-p830523
http://www.morrisminorspares.com/front-suspension-c47/front-suspension-all-models-c71/fulcrum-pin-lower-trunnion-p830553
http://www.morrisminorspares.com/front-suspension-c47/front-suspension-all-models-c71/eyebolt-rear-spring-bush-polyurethane-2-required-per-side-each-p830512

Do a close inspection of the threads on the swivel. You are looking for an Acme style thread. Worn threads will have a pointy profile. Compare the top with the lower thread since the upper usually is in better shape, less load. You have to remove the brake backing plate enough to spin the trunnion off.

Wee MG 1963 Avatar
Wee MG 1963 Gold Member Thomas W
Crystal Lake, Flat, boring Midwest, USA   USA
1957 Morris Minor 1000 "Sadie"
1973 MG Midget MkIII "Sunflower"
Hi Drew - I just finished the passenger side rebuild on my car - which, because I am very OCD - took longer than it should have because I took the opportunity to clean and repaint the inner fender/wheel arches before proceeding. I am sure the driver's side (RHD on my car) will go faster, but I am also committing to cleaning and repainting that wheel arch as well - which now needs to wait until the weather is conducive (spray painting - and I am in Northern IL). Feel free to PM me with any questions.

The suggestion I will make, since it is a complete rebuild, is to remove the brakes completely (are you rebuilding those as well?). This enable a lot better access to the lower trunnion assy., and the lower steady bar link bolts, etc. It is not absolutely necessary - but very helpful.

The "eye bolt" is the large diameter pin that holds the lower suspension arm assy. to the chassis leg. It passes through the chassis leg, and may have shims on the outside (wheel arch side) under the circular seat of the pin into which the bushings are located. Once you drive back the lower arm off the torsion bar, you can remove it by undoing the large nut (well over an inch dia. as I recall) which is on the inside/s of the front chassis rails, approximately by the rear of the oil sump/pan.

Removing tension from the system is CRUCIAL before beginning disassembly. You won't kill yourself as with a coil spring that goes flying across your shop, but you will find it almost impossible to drive out the lower link pin without the tension being "neutral" or off the torsion bar. Before I started, I painted a piece of 3/8 plywood flat white (so I could read my notes later made with a sharpie marker), and held it up against the suspension at full droop (brakes removed, chassis legs supported on jack stands, suspension still assembled but on full droop) and drilled holes of corresponding diameter for the upper and lower link bolts (nuts removed), and hedged my bets by measuring the distance to the ground for each, and writing them on the board. By creating this template you will ensure that upon reassembly you will be putting the lower suspension arm on correctly to the exact torsion bar spline location from which it came. Failure to do this will dramatically alter the ride height (either really high or really low - even if only off by one spline).

The torsion bar itself is made of very high grade tool steel, and if you think you will be able to mark the location on the torsion bar with a file or punch, you are wrong. At least I couldn't, and you don't want to bung up the splines in any case.

Once you have completely rebuilt it all, the only real wear item you'll have to replace again will be the upper, outer link. I used urethane bushings for the ones I never want to have to deal with again (eye-bolt, lower link, lower steady-bar), but I used rubber for the upper outer link because the "squishiness" will make it easier to replace in the future - and because I have read many people's reports that using urethane for the upper link results in a big increase in ride/steering harshness.

Best of luck. First one is a bit of an anxiety attack, the other side will have you feeling like an old pro.

Tom
Tom

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emjay Jim English
Marietta, PA, USA   USA
The eyebolt nut is about 15/16 or more appropriately 1/2Whitworth. While we are on Whitworth, you'll need 5/15 W for most along with one 1/4W and one or two 3/8W.

pixelsmithusa Avatar
The eyebolt goes through the frame leg and is the anchor/pivot point for the front of the torsion bar and thus the inner lower link. Regardless of whether you order rubber or Urethane, the front suspension bushing kit include the bushings for the eyebolt. However, should you wish to use rubber, I would still order the Urethan ones separately to use on the torsion bar. Reason being that they'll hold up much better and shouldn't have much effect as ride harshness like the others might. It requires significant disassembly to replace, so another reason to go the extra mile while you are at it.

While you are in there, take a close look at the frame where the eyebolt passes through the frame and make sure you don't see any stress cracks there in the frame leg. I've had a to repair a couple. It's not very common, but it's a very unsafe condition if it is compromised.



Gerard

http://gerardsgarage.com/



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2018-03-19 02:47 PM by pixelsmithusa.


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drooartz Avatar
drooartz Drew Frink
Midway, UT, USA   USA
Thanks folks, very helpful discussion for me. I'm getting a better feel for what I'm getting myself into. I'm hoping to be able to disassemble some of the car soon before I order parts, but depending on my work schedule that may or may not be possible.

I am doing the front brakes. Maggie currently has Spridget front discs, but they're just not good enough -- I've been able to fade them in spirited driving. Thinking about changing to the JLH Ford kit for the fronts.

On a related note, what's the best location for jack stands in the rear of the car if I'm going to disassemble the suspension? Normally I just put them under the axle, but that won't work if I'm taking it all apart.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2018-03-19 08:35 PM by drooartz.

pixelsmithusa Avatar
Drew,

Depends on how much access you need at the rear. You could use the area at the rear spring hanger location or the factory jacking points (see pic). I found the jacking points left me better access to all the forward spring mounts. It's near the balance point, but as long as you have the front anchored with the engine and all in place, it should stay nose down.

You might want to take a look at the design that Charles Durning (Geezer) developed. I have a few sets of the water jet cut mounting brackets that he designed. I have the whole set ready to go on my Morris Minor pickup. It's a DIY set using Nissan calipers and vented rotors. Everything is available new stateside quite reasonably.

https://www.morrisminorforum.com/journal/geezer/13365



In reply to # 29093 by drooartz Thanks folks, very helpful discussion for me. I'm getting a better feel for what I'm getting myself into. I'm hoping to be able to disassemble some of the car soon before I order parts, but depending on my work schedule that may or may not be possible.

I am doing the front brakes. Maggie currently has Spridget front discs, but they're just not good enough -- I've been able to fade them in spirited driving. Thinking about changing to the JLH Ford kit for the fronts.

On a related note, what's the best location for jack stands in the rear of the car if I'm going to disassemble the suspension? Normally I just put them under the axle, but that won't work if I'm taking it all apart.



Gerard

http://gerardsgarage.com/


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0123 Mike D
Biddulph, Staffs, UK   GBR
In reply to # 29093 by drooartz Thanks folks, very helpful discussion for me. I'm getting a better feel for what I'm getting myself into. I'm hoping to be able to disassemble some of the car soon before I order parts, but depending on my work schedule that may or may not be possible.

I am doing the front brakes. Maggie currently has Spridget front discs, but they're just not good enough -- I've been able to fade them in spirited driving.

Have you drilled 'em yet?

Thinking about changing to the JLH Ford kit for the fronts.

On a related note, what's the best location for jack stands in the rear of the car if I'm going to disassemble the suspension? Normally I just put them under the axle, but that won't work if I'm taking it all apart.


According the manual
you can hang the back end off
the bumper irons

I put stands under the "Chassis"
in front of the spring hangers

emjay Jim English
Marietta, PA, USA   USA
The panel across the back of the boot is fairly strong, so a stout piece of wood will be plenty. Also the weld seem where the boot floor and the inner fender meet, just below the bumper support is also a good place to support the body. If you plan to roll the axle out, you can move the support up to where the rear wings meet the sill or rocker once the weight of the axle is on the ground. Short spans of pinch weld seems are very strong.

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